JRE MMA Show #86 with Josh Thomson

Episode Summary

Main Topics

This episode delves into the unique culture of mixed martial arts, critically examining the role of commentators who lack deep understanding, such as Stephen A. Smith, and emphasizing the profound respect owed to fighters for their sacrifices. Joe Rogan and Josh Thomson also discuss the complex business landscape of MMA promotions, advocating for cross-promotional fights to elevate the sport and address the challenges fighters face in career longevity and financial stability. The conversation further explores fighter management, training methodologies at elite camps like AKA, and specific matchup analyses for top-tier talents across various organizations.

Key Discussion Points

• Critique of Stephen A. Smith's MMA Commentary: Joe Rogan and Josh Thomson strongly condemn Stephen A. Smith's dismissive remarks, particularly his accusation of Donald "Cowboy" Cerrone being a "quitter" after his 40-second loss to Conor McGregor. They highlight Smith's profound lack of understanding of fighting's physical and emotional toll, referencing his "dick-punching" incident, and criticize the "sports radio" culture of denigrating athletes, which is ill-suited for the personal and dangerous nature of MMA. Thomson expresses disappointment with Daniel Cormier and Kendall Grove for defending Smith, seeing it as "toeing the company line."
• The Respectful Nature of Combat Sports vs. "Sports Guy Talk": Rogan and Thomson draw a clear distinction between traditional sports commentary and the respect demanded by MMA, where fighters are "naked physically, naked emotionally." They argue that unlike team sports, losing a fight is devastating and requires a different perspective. They laud Conor McGregor's post-fight respect despite his trash-talking during promotion, and stress the importance of elevating rather than demeaning fighters, particularly by those who lack experience or knowledge in the sport.
• Challenges and Transitions in Fighters' Careers: Thomson elaborates on the financial realities and post-fighting struggles of many athletes, noting that most don't earn "Conor McGregor money." He shares his personal philosophy, "your new life is gonna cost you your old one," advising fighters to fully commit to new ventures rather than "hanging on" to their fighting identity. He discusses the "constant hustle" of managing businesses like his martial arts gym and clothing line to supplement income, and the importance of budgeting through slow periods.
• MMA Organization Dynamics and Cross-Promotion: The discussion highlights the UFC's power in shaping narratives, contrasting it with Bellator and ONE FC. Thomson insists that Bellator boasts elite fighters like Douglas Lima and Patricio Pitbull, who could "compete with anybody in the world," challenging the notion that only UFC fighters are top-tier. Both hosts express strong desire for cross-promotional fights (e.g., Lima vs. Kamaru Usman, Patricio Pitbull vs. Max Holloway), believing such matchups would ultimately benefit the sport and fans, despite the UFC's perceived "isolationist perspective."
• Fighter Management and Development: The conversation contrasts the slow, deliberate "grooming" of boxers by managers with MMA's tendency to throw talented prospects like Aaron Pico "to the wolves" prematurely, often against tough competition for contractual reasons. Thomson recounts his own experience being offered an unknown "savage from Dagestan" by Joe Silva instead of a title shot after knocking out Nate Diaz, facing a six-month "shelving" threat for refusing. This illustrates the pressure fighters face from promoters regarding opponent selection.

Notable Moments

• Josh Thomson's Encounter with Joe Silva: After spectacularly knocking out Nate Diaz, Thomson was set for a title shot against Anthony Pettis. When Pettis pulled out, UFC matchmaker Joe Silva offered him a fight against a then-unknown "savage from Dagestan," threatening to "shelf" Thomson for six months if he declined, highlighting the challenging power dynamics between fighters and promoters.
• Frank Shamrock's Unconventional Training: Josh Thomson recounted a striking anecdote about training with Frank Shamrock, where Shamrock reportedly vomited on the mat during a round but continued training without interruption, only cleaning it up after the round was completed. This demonstrated Shamrock's extreme dedication and refusal to let anything break his focus during conditioning.
• Dana White's Demand to Big John McCarthy: Thomson revealed that Big John McCarthy, a prominent MMA referee and analyst, once had a successful podcast with "100 or 150 thousand subscribers." However, Dana White allegedly issued an ultimatum, telling McCarthy to "get rid of the podcast or we can't use you," leading McCarthy to delete his show, illustrating the promotional control over figures associated with their brand.

Key Takeaways

The episode emphasizes that genuine knowledge and respect are paramount for anyone commenting on MMA, advocating for the elevation of fighters and their intense dedication. It powerfully illustrates the crucial need for fighters to plan for life beyond the cage, managing finances and transitioning careers with the same intensity as their fighting, and criticizes promotions for not adequately supporting this. Ultimately, the discussion promotes a vision where cross-promotional fights between top talents from all organizations enhance the sport and reward fans, rather than being hindered by business rivalries.